61 thoughts on “Today’s moment of zen

  1. And that is the funniest admission of this government’s incompetence I’ve ever witnessed.
    My 12 year old son is more careful with his lies than this idiot.

  2. I think he meant to say that 900.000 went and voted for Capriles, after voting for Chavez in 2012. That, more or less, fits the official data.

    • I don’t think it does, unless they’re going to claim 200,000+ oppos defected.

      • That’s right. THAT’s the admissionf of fraud: “we can see who voted”. That, alas, cannot be done, and it is merely a threat.

        • Either way, notice our resident fascists, GAC and Arutro, don’t denounce this threat (whether Maduro is telling the truth or not), they are very pleased to let it stand without comment.

  3. You discuss here the maths of this guy. On other occasions I have done so too but here
    I am completely appalled at the level of shitty, completely despicable threat from someone who is supposed to be a politician. Díaz said it is not true but if you put yourself in the shoes of the
    humble people you will see he is just saying the vote is not secret and those who voted against him need to fear.
    It doesn’t matter he said that with a fake smile. This is serious stuff, guys. Whether you have a fake gun or not and you are pointing at someone, you are committing a crime. The same here. Funnily, the national newspapers don’t seem to pick on that, just Díaz saying it’s false and Capriles saying it’s proof of fraud.

    The point is this: a threat such as this, stating also – even if it were a lie- that the vote is not secret would be enough to cause massive protests…in a nation still with some sense of what democracy is.

      • I don’t know but to me this is the kind of threat that goes much beyond the threats Chávez used, even when he said tanks would go to the cities and blood would be shed.
        I mean: you could pretend to interpret those Chavez threats as “he meant if the opposition used force first”, even if we know he didn’t mean it that way. But here Maduro’s threat, as fib as it might be, should make us demand a clear statement from each one and all the Latin American and international organisations.
        Will they do something? Not as long as money keeps flowing but pressure will increase.

      • Yes, but taking it from the source where he is such a tuki, are you surprised he’d flub saying something correctly?

        If Chavez were to say that, I’d beleive it was an admission of fraud. Maduro saying it? I think its an admission that he is ineptes.

  4. The Constitution says the vote is secret. Maduro says he knows the name and i.d. number of 900,000 people who voted against him. If this is true he should do jail time, if not, he is lying to the public and should resign, as did Richard Nixon for the same reason…

  5. Liking the Daily Show reference!!! I have always thought that a similar show based on Venezuelan news/politicians would be sooo funny! I would be the ‘primer chicharron’ on that queue to be part of that writing team!

    • How long would the Daily Show or The Colbert Report last in Venezuela? Does Egypt’s Bassem Youssef come to mind?

  6. According to what they are saying in aporrea, we kind of “misunderstood” what maduro said. He is referring to 900.000 people from the PSUV (who have signed up with cedulas and everything on their lists) who did not go to vote. But it is also not illegal to know who voted and who abstained?

    • In the U.S., each person who votes is announced publicly. This is also recorded and available to anyone later.

      These records are necessary to prevent fraud.

      For instance, a person voting in another person’s name can be called out by pollwatchers: “You’re not Mrs. Frickenfrack!”

      It can detect fraud after the election – if dead or relocated voters are found to have voted.

      Non-voting also helps identify dead and relocated voters, so their registrations can be purged.

      It also allows party workers to go out to remind non-voters to come out.

      We have party “primary” elections, and the primary chosen by the voter is recorded. This allows the election board to assign judges of election by party (each polling place gets two or three from both parties),

      • Even if what Maduro said was that: in the USA it’s everyone who knows. In Venezuela we asked for the information about who voted and they don’t want to give that.

      • A bit of a digression from the topic at hand, but…

        I think it varies rather by state, in the U.S. While the right to vote is constitutionally guaranteed, the states are responsible for overseeing and moderating the election laws. The records do not show who you voted for, but if you have a party affiliation, and if you voted, is recorded for the reasons you listed above as far as clearing the rolls. That’s why, prior to the election, some of the states were facing federal challenges to enacted and extremely stringent “voter ID” laws that were supposedly emplaced to fight voter fraud.

        For example, in the state I live in, the citizens do not have access to voting records and this was affirmed by the state records board back in 2007. (The auditing system seems to have some minor issues as well…we use Diebold, not Smartmatic, but, really, no big diff.) Likewise, while we have party primaries, per se, the process of who goes to the primary is determined by caucuses (caucii?) in which the primary contestants are selected only by registered members of the party. Given that about 70% of the state votes one way, the actual election is pretty much determined months in advance by the caucus and the primary for that party. This has also allowed fringe groups, such as the Tea Party, to seize positions within the Republican caucuses in “off” election years and subsequently force candidates out that are ideologically non-aligned with them.

        My home state does have a secret ballot and has since, oh, 1878, when it was a U.S. territory (twas also the the second territory/state to enfranchise women, in 1870). This was largely due to the “party” line being heavily tied to the local dominant religion. Literally, you would have vote counts of 3500 – 3 in some districts. An anecdote from the 1860s and 1870s when federal magistrates were sent to the territory and were often in opposition to the territorial governor is that they would take incoming judge or fed agent to a religious meeting of several hundred people and ask, by a show of hands, how many approved this or that measure and how many disapproved. It was always unanimous.

        Sadly, in a similar vein to PSUV, the controlling party in this state is extremely resistant to any sort of changes to the electoral laws that might put their hegemony at risk. You have your rojo rojitos you struggle with; I have mine.

        The thing that has struck me as so fundamentally screwed up about the Venezuelan situation is that the CNE was wholly unwilling (aside from Diaz, obviously) to recount. We’ve had a number of recounts locally, for both state and federal offices (almost always when, *gasp*, a democrat wins) and its not considered anything exotic and both sides always agree to abide by it without issue. Hiding behind the “infallability” of the system to deny a recount seems wholly salacious, since doing it would simply validate the process and lend legitimacy, at least in foreign eyes, to the whole thing.

        Time consuming? Yes. But, if it proves that they won and would give them that much more leverage over the next 6 years, even discounting the poll station irregularities, why not do it?

    • Anyway, he is (at least, I don’t find a longer video fragment) stating that they know who didn’t vote, with “C.I. and all”, that is not simply stating “we know that 900.000 of the PSUV-members stayed at home”

  7. A Maduro nadie lo respeta, ni en la oposición ni en el chavismo. Esta afirmación de Maduro no lo ayuda mucho. El cree que podrá meterle miedo a los “900 mil” que ya tiene identificados (lo que es otra mentira más de Nicolás). El problema es que con estas amenazas no tan veladas y con sus encontronazos con los respondones en las llamadas “asambleas populares”, Maduro pierde el poco respeto residual que le tenían los propios chavistas. Hablo de “respeto residual”, pues fue el propio Chávez que pidió que respetaran a Maduro con una especie de “transferencia de fondos” que le hizo. El balance en la “cuenta de respeto” de Maduro cae todos los días. Pronto se acercará a cero.

  8. A todo chanchito le llega su navidad. Maduro’s toast, he just exhibits all the characteristics of a man who is desperately fighting against inevitability. The fact he even has to make these threats shows how weak his position is. What a joke, he’s out to sea without a paddle.

    • When people in power publicly say things which can be construed as threatening, which produce fear in others , its not necessarily because they coldly calculate the practical political effect of their statements , but because their warped narcicism finds glee in showing themselves superbly capable of hurting people , to demonstrate the reach of their inmense power . Chavistas learned through their now defunct leader the intoxication of feeling all powerful and of exhibiting with melodramatic panache their grand hold on power. Maduros self sattisfied chuckle as he revealed his knowledge of who had not voted for him is telling , it suggests that he is playing the all knowing powerful man who can if he wants hurt his enemies , that they cannot hide behind electoral procedures to scape his reprisals . This is very perverse . The sadism of the bully is very much a part of the Chavista mental make up. This statement may be just another example of that !
      .

      • I think there was one thing that was telling about the statements he made. If he knows the cedulas and names of the 900,000 people who voted Chavista in October but not April, then logic would dictate he also knows the information on all the opposition voters. Why not threaten them as well?

        After all, Tascon would seem to indicate they have no issue whatsoever exacting any sort of piddling revenge on whomever disagrees with them. Yet, have there been any reprisals or threats of reprisals against those who have always voted opposition?

        I understand that someone who has been stoutly chavista would likely have much more to lose since the demographic that they largely pull from will have some sort of tie to the state, either socially or economically, but still…it makes little sense: be they a bumpkin from Tinaco or Maria Corina Machado, why threaten one, but not the other? These folks are now opposition, so why single them out; what gain is there aside from a psychological battering? Trying to segment the opposition? Return the sheep to the fold as it were? I doubt threats will help the matter since its pretty much a 50-50 split. That old saw about flies, honey and vinegar….

        At the rate this guy is burning his political capital, he’ll be lucky to be in office by December short of force of arms.

        • Chavistas have always felt highly empowered by the thought that they have the support not of a tiny mayority but of a grand mayority , Therefore their fall in april from having that grand mayority to a tiny minority or, if Capriles is right, to minority status , hits them hard in their self confidence . This wound to their pride and self confidence must be very painful for Maduro who was annointed standard bearer and succesor by Chavez himself and yet failed to maintain their so highly prized grand mayority. More alarmingly the conditions that in part caused this fall in the Regimes popularity ( the shortages , the electrical black outs ,the worsening finances , an assertive and confident opposition leadership ) are still there so that Maduro must be fearing the possibility of an additional slide in popularity . He is therefore desperate to gain back the support of lost supporters , by hook or crook, What cards does he have to ward off these threats .? A more aggresive media campaign to curry favour with his traditional supporters by making the tie between rulers and people more personal ( el gobierno de calle campaign) , restoring normal electrical services through stop gag emergency measures ( the restructuring of Corpoelec), fighting shortages by seeking alliances with formerly scorned private local producers to increase supply of domestic goods ( the reapproachement with Polar and other private trade associations) , an attempt at adopting financial policies that are more pragmatical and realistic ( dropping giordani and appointing Merentes) and finally implementing a campaign of reprisals and threats against those most dependent on the regime to make a living , which entails letting them think that he can identify them if needed ( the statement that he knows who they are ) . If Maduro is to carry forth the regimes more radical programs he needs to shore up the regimes popular support , also if he is to stem any inside threat to his future leadership.
          He knows his chances of convincing the hard core opposition to join forces with him is nill , so he must concentrate on those who at heart have one day felt some sympathy for what the regime used to represent.

      • The main problem Maduro has is that he inherited the pedantic and confrontational style of Chavez and he believes that he just needs to copy it to obtain the same results. It’s a gross miscalculation though because that style (the ‘guapo y apoyado’ style) is only viable when it’s accompanied with a lot of popular support which he doesn’t have right now. He is trying to be ‘guapo’ but he is missing the ‘apoyado’ part.

        He forgets that Chavez would back down very quickly from those attitudes when things were not going his way. He would appear humble and apologetic even conciliatory when required only to be pedantic again once the storm had passed.

  9. Meanwhile AVN is doing a good job making Chigüire Bipolar look dull:
    Lamborghinis y Hummers incautados al narco serán sumados a misión A Toda Vida
    “En el estado Lara tenemos una flota de 14 vehículos de lujo entre ellos Lamborghinis y Hummers. Vamos a ponerle a cada uno su calcomanía de A Toda Vida Venezuela para darle seguridad al pueblo”, expresó Rodríguez Torres, en un contacto con una televisora nacional.

    http://www.aporrea.org/contraloria/n229131.html

    Good use of resources? Yeah, put a decal on it and it is done!

    • That’s how they can justify keeping it in house and driving it. Branded for revolutionaries, driven by revolutionaries.

      I think the tail end of the article was rather fascinating. The mere fact that they would have to “remind” the law enforcement apparati that they need to return recovered vehicles in a day says quite a bit. Annnnnnd that this reminder would have to appear in the news as well.

  10. You know you’re full of shit when this video is the best “evidence” of fraud that you can come up with.

    Hey JC, why have you been so silent about Capriles’ lies? What ever happened to those 286 opposition witnesses that were forced out of voting centers at gunpoint?

    I suppose we’re all just supposed to forget about those nonsense claims now? You clearly have.

    • What ever happened to those claims by Capriles that there were more votes in some centers than registered voters? The only example he gave was a complete lie.

      Are we supposed to just forget about that now? You clearly have.

      • Notice GAC does not denounce this statement, instead he is happy to let Maduro’s threat stand, and attempts to turn the discussion to supposed failures of the opposition. He knows of course Capriles statements have nothing to do with Maduro’s illegal threat, but GAC will do anything to draw attention away from that which he would prefer be silent. Typical fascism.

        • Notice Norske does not denounce Capriles’ false statements which resulted in violence and several deaths. He is happy to let those lies stand, and attempts to turn the discussion to a completely irrelevant remark made by Maduro. He knows, of course, that Maduro’s statements have nothing to do with the alleged “fraud” that they claim occurred, but will do anything to draw attention away from that which he would prefer be silent. Typical fascism.

          • What an epic failure of a retort.

            You already know why you are wrong, but lets go over it anyway. First, Capriles is not responsible for what other people do, or the criminals that killed demonstrators, regardless of political orientation. Secondly you are the one diverting from the topic at hand. Maduro’s illegal threat, THAT is the topic of this post.

            All that said, I will humor you and agree that insofar as claims of fraud should be correct, but making statements about possible fraud, and Maduro stating he knows who voted for whom are in different leagues. One of them is illegal, one of them is at the most irresponsible.

            • And I notice you still implicitly support Maduro’s fascist statement, ergo you are a died in the wool fascist.

            • “First, Capriles is not responsible for what other people do, or the criminals that killed demonstrators, regardless of political orientation.”

              Oh really? Political actors who know that the situation is highly charged do not have any responsibility of assuring that their declarations do not raise the level of tension to an exploding point? Especially when those declarations are unfounded? You’re brilliant.

              “Maduro’s illegal threat, THAT is the topic of this post.”

              I would respond about that, but it simply never happened. Please show where Maduro makes a threat.

              “One of them is illegal, one of them is at the most irresponsible.”

              One of them caused deaths, the other didn’t. But I see where your priorities are.

      • No one bothers with you, dear sir. Any evidence presented, including signed witness statements, you disparage as ‘unverified’. There is no evidence you will accept.

        Yet you make all sorts of accusations with no evidence whatsoever.

        Engaging with your is utterly pointless.

        (I write this mainly for those out there who may be stumbling onto this website for the first time. To see Get a Clue in action, and understand why no one can take him seriously and why most feel engaging him is a waste of time, please look back to other comment threads. Furthermore, he doesn’t live in Venezuela, and is not Venezuelan. He’s a self-loathing American who cheerleads the ‘revolution’ from the safety of his own home, 1000s of miles away from the decaying, dangerous, and sad reality that is Venezuela after 14 years of ‘revolution’.)

      • Nice try Lee, but there are thousands of voting centers, and this article gives 13 examples of irregularities with no verifiable evidence that what these people said is actually true. Not only that, not even all 13 of those listed here were real irregularities. In many of them the auditoria was clearly carried out as it should be.

        “A pesar de las amenazas, no dejamos de hacer todo el trabajo”

        “esta vez hicimos un operativo para evitar esos problemas”

        “En otros centros no se auditó, porque la gente tenía miedo, por el amedrentamiento” (oh, in OTHER centers there was no audit? Which ones for example? Because in YOUR center there WAS an audit!)

        ” A las 11:00 pm se hizo una auditoría”

        What you idiots don’t seem to understand, is that for the kind of fraud that Capriles is claiming to have actually occurred and not show up in the actas, it would have required that the Chavistas controlled the votes for THOUSANDS of voting centers without any opposition witnesses or audits.

        As even Toro has noted (but now has become silent) it would be practically impossible to do this without it showing up in the actas. Keep trying though. Its fun watching you squirm.

            • Why must you deflect from the topic of the threads, always? This thread is about Maduro saying he knows the names of voters. Do you support the government exposing the identities of a voters and using them again as in la lista?

              • Poor John, he can’t respond to anything I said.

                No, John, I don’t “support the government exposing the identities of voters and using them again [sic] them”. Thankfully that isn’t happening, and your hysteria over this comment of Maduro is as unfounded as always.

                Cheers!

  11. Capriles is saying on Twitter a big new is coming tomorrow, someone from the regime is going to talk or something.

  12. For Get a Clue —

    I agree, Capriles lied. No hard evidence has been provided by the opposition of fraud. Furthermore, the opposition leadership does not represent some wonderful, democratic alternative.

    Having admitted that, would you care to address Maduro’s threat?

    • Nope, he loves Maduro’s threat.

      I agree the evidence of ballot stuffing is lacking, Capriles should have been more honest about that. The real fraud was using finger prints to track down voters, and threats before and after the election against potential opposition voters.

      For a delusional traveller like GAC, the fact that the opposition is not infallible is enough to continue his belief in the revolution, that is all that matters for him. He can go on admiring the benevolent savages of Venezuela.

      • “I agree the evidence of ballot stuffing is lacking, Capriles should have been more honest about that.”

        Hahaha! This doesn’t address the fact that all the examples Capriles gave were just complete lies, nor does it address the supposed 286 witnesses forced out at gunpoint, nor the claim about “damaged machines”, etc. etc. He should have been more honest?? He wasn’t honest at all. How about “he should have been less of a blatant liar”?

    • Dave,

      You are the first person on this entire blog to admit that. Shouldn’t that make you realize something about the people here?

      Now, I would be glad to address Maduro’s “threat”, but there is one small problem. It doesn’t exist. He is not making a threat at all. He is saying that they need to find out why they lost the vote of so many PSUV members between the October election and the April election. At no time does he say he is going to do anything to those people.

      And for those of you that think that the government is massively firing employees who didn’t vote for Maduro, you obviously don’t live in Venezuela, or don’t have a connection to people who do. No one believes that here, because everyone knows someone who is anti-Chavez who works in some government agency, etc.

      • I’m quite familiar with the dishonest tendencies of the opposition. But I also think the Chavista side is even worse. Blaming Chavez’s death on the US inoculating him with cancer? How much more blatantly dishonest and propagandistic can you get than that?

        And I suppose we’ll just have to agree to disagree on the “threat”. While the government isn’t “massively firing employees”, they absolutely have fired employees for not supporting the government politically. I don’t live in Venezuela now, but I did. I know people who were fired for not being sufficiently rojo rojito. I know employees of PDVSA who are forced to go to Chavista rallies. One even had to reschedule a wedding last minute because of this in the most recent election.

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